E214:Kait from MI

[00:00:00] Jill Brook: Hello, fellow POTS patients and magnificent people who care about POTS patients. I'm Jill Brook, your horizontal host, and today we have an episode of the POTS Diaries. And today we're speaking with Kait. Thank you so much for joining us today, Kait. Kait: Yes, thanks Jill. Glad to be here. Jill Brook: Okay, so let's just start with some basics about you. What are the, the, the details we should know just to be able to put you in context? Like, where are you? What's your age? What should we know? Kait: Sure. So, I am 33 years old and I live in northern Michigan, in a rural town and we actually farm. So, we're a farm family. Jill Brook: Oh, neat. What kinds of things do you grow? Kait: Oh, all sorts of things. We we raise cattle. We do other commodities. So, seasonal from maple syrup to sweet corn, pumpkins, you name it. So, hands in a lot of things. Jill Brook: Oh, that sounds amazing! Wow! Okay, what else should we know about your living situation? Who do you live with? Who else is there besides you and some cows? Kait: Yeah, so, I am [00:01:00] married, my husband Alex and I have been married for 10 years this year, and we have 3 beautiful children, ages 9, soon to be 7, and 4, and we have a cat and a dog. Jill Brook: Okay, and how would your family describe your personality? Kait: Eww. Probably driven, active. I'm a busy body. I like to do a lot of different things. I would say that's, that's it. Jill Brook: Can you tell us about some of your busy body activities or your passions? Kait: Yeah. So I am so passionate about the wellness field. So really into anything nutrition movement, any of that kind of stuff. The outdoors, anything outdoors, barefoot, outside, dirt, love digging in the dirt being on, you know, being a farmer's wife growing up on a farm, flowers, vegetable garden, anything. Traveling, all that kind of stuff. Jill Brook: That sounds amazing. Yeah. Have you always been so into wellness? Kait: Yeah, I think that naturally you know, my family were, you know, very [00:02:00] healthy and active growing up. So, I think naturally that was kind of instilled in me. And also growing up on a farm, that's like the biggest playground a kid could ask for, right? So, lots of acreage, lots of things to do, always something to do, right? You're not sitting a lot. So, yeah, I think that kind of stemmed that. And then being active in sports as a kid, you know, and just our community, the things that we did. So, so yeah. Jill Brook: So did you have a life before POTS? And if so, how long ago was that? And can you give us a snapshot of like what you were doing in that last year leading up to when POTS hit? Kait: Sure. So yes, I was 14 years old when I started exhibiting symptoms. And I was your overachieving, active teenager. I was involved in all the things from, you know, NHS, Student Council, sports, Church, just community involvement. And yeah, upon POTS diagnosis, things did definitely change. Jill Brook: So what were the first signs of [00:03:00] POTS? Kait: Really interesting. So I recall, I often tell this story, when I first became ill, I thought I was having a dream. My things kind of apparently set in and on during the night I remember waking up and thinking that was like a really terrible nightmare. Like, what the heck? And it was my reality. Little did I know when I walked out to see my mom, I'll never forget her face. So my, my symptoms set in over a course of probably after a couple weeks that true POTS symptoms had shown. We believe that POTS stemmed from a virus, an unknown virus, so my body was going through a lot. To this day, we don't know what that was, but you know, mono, like all the blood tests were done. Everything was negative. We didn't know what was going on. So yeah, for being an active go getter, going to bed and then one night waking up and having hives and, and, you know, like arthritic pain and just all this, all these crazy things was just very, very [00:04:00] crazy. Jill Brook: So just overnight, it set in. Kait: I remember, I mean, we had plans, like I had finished volleyball practice and I was gonna go you know, I did my homework and planned for the weekend kind of a thing and I just woke up and I had, I mean, yeah, we weren't going to be doing those things. So we were going to the doctor. So, that was kind of my first, it kind of snowballed from there. And you know, my personal story day to day, it just, there were different things. Every day we'd wake up and something was new. My fingers were swollen, my, you know, whatever was going on, my extremities, and the doctors just kept looking at me like, wow, you know, like this is, you know, we, we need to help this girl. You know, we need to figure out what's going on. So, yeah, that was kind of the beginning of the craziness. And then not long after I was lucky to, to in passing have a physician happen to have attended a symposium about POTS, this crazy new idea, right? Because this was in 2005, and he had passed that on to my physician. So we were able to book in with Mayo Clinic. It took about four months, but [00:05:00] we ended up getting out there to be tested for POTS. Jill Brook: Okay, so you had a diagnosis within about four months. Kait: Yes, roughly. Yeah. Jill Brook: And so once you had a diagnosis, were you able to find treatments that helped very much? Kait: So yes, upon diagnosis I remember that day vividly. My physician had stated kind of actually asked me, kind of reverse psychology, was asking me a lot of questions. And I remember thinking, what in the heck? I've done all these tests, you know, you know, you're supposed to tell me what is going on. And he really was doing a, a psych eval, and he was assessing to see, you know, where I was at, and two routes, right? Pharma doing medical treatment, more medicine, medicinal route, or doing non pharmacological modes. And for me he really thought that I was a great candidate for the non pharmacological. So I did start on beta blockers and we did, I was actually on some depression meds as well, just with going through all of that which I didn't last long on either. I didn't like the way they made me feel. And so I really, the treatment was oriented around high salt intake and activity. [00:06:00] So at that time, there wasn't any specifics, more than that, just, you know, progress lightly as you can and try to keep at it three to five days a week. And that was, I remember, pretty crazy to hear given how you feel when you have POTS. They were asking me to go run, you know, or things of that nature, and I was just mind blown. But I was actually really excited because I was such an active you know, adolescent prior to getting this illness and having been literally bedridden for four months, I was like, I can? Like, what? When can we start? I remember being so excited, like, mom, let's go, let's go. So that was like such a light to hear, you know, oh, we finally know what it is. And he is actually telling me to go move and that that is okay. And I also remember him saying, you know, expect to lead an active life after this. You know, they don't have a definite cure, but just plan to be active, which I just, in passing, was like, yeah, I like to be active, so we don't probably know whatever's going on here. Anyways, so, so yeah, that was kind of the cards we were dealt with treatment, [00:07:00] but from then moving on, it was all on us. I mean, I, I just remember feeling kind of alone in that way. You know, here we go. Like, this is what, what, what will work for you. What can help just go do it was kind of the attitude. Jill Brook: And so when you went and you just did it, how did it go for you, all that exercise? Kait: Yeah, great question. So we started, I remember being handed the paper and I was so excited. The little notes that my nurse had left and being back home, flying back home very optimistic, very excited. And then I remember the day, the first week, even walking to the door, you know, I just started crying because I was so sick. I mean, I couldn't, I, tachycardic episodes, you know, the whole postural, everything was in full swing. So I'd go lay down. So it was really rough. And I think that was something that I personally did not prep for in a way was the mental weight that that had, you know, and especially being a teenager, you know, well for anybody, but you know, I just trying to handle that [00:08:00] and figure it out. That was pretty heavy and I, but ultimately, ultimately over time I can laugh about it now, but my mom, we have a golf cart and she would actually ride on the golf cart with water you know, alongside me on the road so I could run and then if I needed to take a break or whatever, so she's kind of my safety net. But it was really just trial and error. And that was kind of the downfall of it is you just, I didn't know what was enough, what was too much. It was really on us and just to figure that out and track it. And luckily, you know, I think given my personality being go getter, just naturally, and I was excited about it, and great support from my family that I was able to stick to a routine, and we just together kind of navigated that. So, I was diagnosed like right in my sophomore year did not I wasn't very active my junior year of high school especially in sports, I was absent from, from, you know, fatigue, which is really hard, but my, I had this motivation, like I am coming back my senior year and I'm going to do this. And I did. Jill Brook: Oh, tell us about that. Yeah, what did you do? What was your activity? Kait: Yeah. So [00:09:00] for me prior to falling ill, basketball was a big part of my life. And as a sophomore, I was being scouted for collegiate sports, right? For, for basketball, collegiate basketball. And I just remember, when I fell ill and the doctor saying, you know, this is what you have, I just remember thinking, I don't have time for this. Like I have things I need to do. I'm ready. I am supposed to do this. And, and so that was a really tough pill to swallow. But that surprisingly was kind of a silver lining that it was my motive to go to get better, you know, cause this wasn't going to be my life. Like I, I had things. Again, I had these goals. So, so I, yeah, my senior year so just training for that. Again, like we, we touched on that, but that was ultimately my motive. And with running so much, I was never a runner. So that should be noted. I mean, I laughed our cross country coaching, I'm six foot. I, our, our coaches were always like, oh, Kait, come run, come down. Like, no, I'm not, I'm not a runner. I'm not doing that. But I had to learn to love to run because that's what my physicians had told me. And so I was a runner [00:10:00] and what I had did prior to my senior year, every year, it's Memorial Day weekend, our small town hosts a 5k and I decided to sign up. Why not? This will be fun. I'm a runner. And I won my age division. I just remember my mom and aunt crying at the finish line like, oh my gosh, she is doing so well. And that was kind of the beginning of like, here we go summer, here we go ready for basketball, you know, in the fall. And and, and I played and it wasn't full capacity of what I would say, but I did it and, and, and it was great. And I still receive scouts and you know, letters to come play at college. Jill Brook: That's fantastic. So, can you talk about just maybe like, I don't know, if it was like a month or a few months when you started the exercise routine, what was that like? Because we probably have some people listening who are in that moment where maybe they have not yet started the exercise. Maybe they still are in bed, but they've been told to exercise and they're wondering, you know, what, so did you just [00:11:00] get up and run or did you have to work up to it? It sounds like nobody told you about the Levine Program. What did it look like? How did you work up to being able to run and win a race? Kait: Yeah. So in 2005, I mean, you know, doing research that wasn't, that wasn't handed to me, you know, during that time Levine Protocol, which is something I am knowledgeable about now and use with clients, but you know, back again on my own, it was just naturally what I know now is progressions. You know, you just find that with your body. The great thing about POTS is it taught me, I have a very strong relationship with my body. You know, you learn your limits. The one thing that was a pro was I did have a polar heart strap. So that was one thing that the doctors encouraged me to get and they did set a target heart rate zone. Wasn't anywhere near what the Levine Protocol offers with training paces, but it did give me that idea. So I was in tune with that. I didn't obsess over it. It was something that was just a great measuring tool. And over time, I eventually did not, I didn't use it. But again, I would just say, yeah, it took, like I said, it took a while you [00:12:00] know, probably about a year of just kind of testing in, dabbling doing walking, doing running. But again, there's more than just the movement, right? And we know that, and especially with research, it's the nutrient timing, it's the salt intake, it's hydration, appropriate rest, which I think is really hard for a lot of POTS individuals, depending on what type of POTS they have, right? It's just learning what is going to work, the time of day, you know, what, what stimulus you're being exposed to, you know, what, what does your life look like? What do your days look like? And I think that, you know, for me as an adolescent, that was tough because you're a teenager. And you have school and you have all these demands and people believe you, they don't believe you, and you're just dealing with all of that. So, yeah, time wise it took some time, but you know, in offering advice to individuals, it just really depends on what your current function level is, but I always say, you know, consistency is key and your environment shapes you. So just always listen to those medical professionals, you know, but [00:13:00] find that accountability you need so that you're feeling, you're feeling like you're making that progress. It's so doable. You just have to believe that and, and have that have the tools to succeed. Jill Brook: So are you personally pretty well functioning at this point? Or how are you doing after kind of figuring out the routines that helped you the most? Kait: Yeah, I would say, so it's funny you ask that because I've had individuals say, you, I forget you're sick, right? They'll use words like that, that, you know, you don't really understand POTS or, or that you were diagnosed with a chronic illness. And to me, I don't I don't use the term recovered as just being a science brain in research, but I, I do not have symptoms. I am symptom free. I've lived symptom free, you know, for a long time probably since age 19. Now what's really interesting is, I will say during like third, I have three kids, right? So during high points of stress, did I have a flash of what I would say would be a POTS episode like you know, tachycardic episodes in [00:14:00] my last trimester of my first pregnancy. You know, after a flight to Arizona in the desert, I had that. But again, is that POTS or is it because I'm a mom and I have brain fog? Or I was having, you know, carrying a baby and I was overly stressed, which the doctor said, you know, women exhibit, you know what I mean? Just, so what is it? And so I guess for me, I don't label that I have, I don't think that way. I'm POTS strong. I just feel strong. I just feel great. I feel healthy. And I love that you asked that question too, because, you know, for me, for so long, it was drilled in my head, you have to run, you know, to feel better, you not have to run, but aerobic, you know, cardio, do something steady state cardio, you're gonna have to eat a lot of salt. I mean, I would, I would, I remember getting salt packets from restaurants and just putting them in my bag, so I had salt, because this was before liquid IV and all the fun stuff we have now. So, but you know, I, I remember thinking like, you have to do this to feel good. And then I remember being in college and playing [00:15:00] basketball and calling my nurse cause I had her cell phone number from Mayo Clinic and she's just like, you're playing basketball. Like I, you were like, I probably like a sloth when I saw her right at age 15. Like, she's like, oh my gosh, Kait, great job. Great work. You know, and we just had that great relationship. She was like my person medically that I could check in with. Right. Rarely that I did. But, when I did she was just like, this is so great, but keep aerobic, you know, keep, basketball is very anaerobic, you know, so, so I always kind of just had that to dabble back into is that aerobic. And and it helped. Again, college, high pace, you're playing basketball, you're stressed. Like, there we go again. Something for the loop, right? Like, in life, but again, I felt great. I was still doing it. And, I guess what I'm getting at is, over time, I developed a value just for wellness as a whole, like a new perspective, given my, my, you know, choice to explore exercise science as my, as my career, you know, in the wellness field. You start to ask, what's your why? Why am I doing this? [00:16:00] If I feel so great, what do I need to do this? And I ended up, interestingly enough, and for my own personal research and with work, last year, I gave it all up. I quit my routine. I don't encourage individuals to do this. But for me, I needed to know that because I had a lot of clients asking, well now, how long do I have to do this for? What's, and I'm like, you know what? It's really interesting. I'm gonna, so I started to dabble and I realized that I just, I don't need to do that acutely anymore, right? I don't have these symptoms that I, I just do it because I want to have I don't want to feel anxious because I have a clear head because it just makes me feel strong. So my why, I think, over time just naturally shifted as I progressed in life and throughout my chapters and that to me was crazy. To me, if I were to think my 15 year old self being diagnosed at age 33, I could say I ran a half marathon and then I decided to give it all up. Like I, wow, you know, so cool. And so, cause you just, with chronic illness, you don't know what's, you know, what's too much, what's not enough, how long, what should I, [00:17:00] you know, you can feel very isolated and alone. So I think just talking with, you know, that's the biggest message for the POTS community for me is you know, you, you are strong, you can, you can do this and, and you need to develop that relationship with your body and, and have that trust in the process, you know, that there are better days ahead. Jill Brook: And so do you have any like specific tips for people doing that? Like when you say kind of having, getting to know your body, having a good relationship with your body? Is there anything? Is that different for each person or do you have any thoughts on how people can do that? Because I think a lot of patients might feel a little bit betrayed by their bodies. Kait: Oh my gosh, yes, yes. And I think what's interesting, and maybe that's my background with special populations with work, is that it comes back to education. And so like you stated, you know, when I was diagnosed, there wasn't the Levine Protocol. You weren't given that. Well, now we have something that you can follow, right? If you're, if you're encouraged to pursue this, it's right there, you know, or you're nutrient, you know, there are things to do. And [00:18:00] I think, initially, that's probably the hardest part is you don't feel believed. You're like, how the heck can I, I am, you know, my heart, you know, this is not even possible. It's like just such a tall order to ask, but it's both, it's becoming educated as to what we know, why this is happening, why our nervous system is dysfunctioning, you know, why we are feeling, you know, separating, like the triggers, like all of the things, just becoming educated and, and, you know, again, like I stated, appropriate stimulus, you know, what are the demands of your day? Do you have appropriate support for this? Do you, are you able to, you know, safely incorporate that exercise routine in your day, or do you have that knowledge with nutrition? You know, that it just goes back to that. I find it really interesting that the more I've worked with the POTS population, or that I, in general, with my career and other adventures, the lifestyle the POTS population ends up adapting to achieve the optimal quality of life, right, to feel great and to function, have limited symptoms, right, [00:19:00] minimal symptoms is what the general population strives for. We want, they want to have, you know, it's like we almost have this, this extra sensitivity or like motive that when we do do these things, we do feel the difference. You do feel better, you know? And so I think that's just so important to keep that optimistic, you know, mindset with it, you know, and again, your environment shapes you. So just finding that, that, that accountability or that, you know, what will work for you. And going back to your question of, you know, what do people, what are the tips, right, ultimately, that was your question. Well, what do you like to do? I mean, like for anybody, when I work with clients in personal training, I wouldn't say, you know, if you, you know, are into the elliptical, if that scares you because you feel like you're going to fall off, well, definitely not going to start there, you know, so, there's just things that you ask yourself. There's so many ways to go about it, and that's what's fun about wellness is it's very versatile that there's a lot of different avenues to explore, and [00:20:00] you just need to, to find what works within, within reason, right? Within the template that you're handed of things to do. Lots of ways to go about it. Jill Brook: So I think you kind of alluded to this but is it correct that you got a major in exercise science and now you are a fitness trainer and you have created a program called POTS Strong, right? For people who are trying to kind of take up exercise as a habit in POTS. Do you want to talk about that? And did I get that right? Kait: Yes, you did. Oh my gosh. So, my, my, originally, prior to POTS, I was growing up on a farm and in a family of agriculture. I was going to go to I wanted to be a veterinarian or do something in animal science. And then after POTS, I think this, amazing relationship with my body and just what the human body is capable of completely took over and the route changed to exercise science, right? So I just wanted to do more with humans. And little did I know every lecture I sat in on and everything, I mean, my lit reviews, every paper was in regards to autonomic function. It was just [00:21:00] so interesting. You know, anytime they talked about certain protocols or programming or this and that, I was like, Oh my, Oh, okay, that's, it helped kind of me understand more scientifically. That was kind of the first time I would say subjectively I was understanding what I went through, or what my body did, and how training helps, how nutrition helps you know, and then being, you know, my first job with my titles you know, working in clinical settings. Objectively, now as a professional, being able to look at special populations and say, oh my gosh, you know, this is, and kind of separate that, it just was such a growth that I didn't realize at the time was happening, but now looking back, I do. And what sparked that is my most recent job. I am a contracted wellness coach for, coach, excuse me, for a really prestigious arts academy here in Michigan and Interlochen Center for the Arts. And I had a student come up to me that forever changed my life. I had never met a person in passing with POTS. I mean, people didn't even know I had POTS, [00:22:00] right? And we, I, it was my job that, that weekend, it was parents weekend. We were inviting everybody into the wellness center and I was standing there at my table, hey, this is what we have to offer for the year. I did a lot of programming there, ran classes, saw students individually. And I remember her walking up, this individual, looking at what I had and then just kind of walk away. But I caught eyes with her mom and I just said, what's going on? You know, what's, what was that all about? And she said, oh, you probably can't help her. You know, she's, she's, she doesn't, you know, it's just probably not going to work. I said, try me. And she said, she has POTS. I said, my floor, I mean, my jaw just dropped. I was like, I have POTS. You know, I know so much about POTS. She's like, really? And so that was my first time ever just meeting somebody and passing and I was like, we need to connect. And so we ended up, I had a contract with her daughter for a couple years while she was, while she was there and what amazed me was how little she knew, and this was 10 years after my diagnosis, and I was sitting there like, oh my gosh, look at what [00:23:00] I'm doing, like, and you, you know, how do you, how are we not aware? So the lack of awareness how she was diagnosed, I was so curious, you know, and she was seeing a cardiologist, and they were telling her, but she just wasn't having it, you know, all the things I said, listen, we got this. So we put it in perspective. I did so much more research, obviously, and again, I haven't touched, I didn't touch on POTS. I never found it to be valuable when I was diagnosed with POTS to be part of support groups, to be talking to other individuals with POTS because it was very negative. I felt like it just didn't help me stay focused on what I was trying to achieve. It made me feel sad a lot or like, I, you know, the struggles, the struggles. I didn't want to focus on that. I wanted to find a positive environment to, to get where I needed. And so I decided to go back into that. I joined, I realized social media was blowing up with POTS groups. I mean, there's so many to be a part of on Facebook, right? And so I started there and I just started really talking with people and other professionals and seeing what was working, you [00:24:00] know, or what they found to have helped. And then it started again, my perspective on myself, I'm not the only one who has found this success, you know, what are the common variables? And so working with this student she joined the volleyball team the next year. I mean, she started to have this more, what we would call, you know, quote unquote normal, I don't like using that term, but life, you know, higher, higher quality life that she wanted. And then I was like, oh my gosh, this just, I just, I just, this fire was lit and I wanted to help and I just wanted to help these people. So yeah, I created an app, actually during COVID, there was plenty of time and it's been amazing. It's been so cool to connect with people you know, around just the the UK, across America last year I had a client drive up. We met in Michigan, you know, to work one on one with each other, virtual coaching, but again, it's just applying, you know, we, we know about the Levine Protocols, so just again, spreading awareness more, more than anything is that, you know, POTS Strong, like how can POTS and strong be in the same context?[00:25:00] And to me, anybody with chronic illness is strong every day you're strong, right? Because you're just dealing with so much to get by day to day. And so it's however you identify as you're strong. Is what, you know, we work through or that person, you know, to get from point A to point B, how, how we go about that. But I think it's so important to have that positive mindset for individuals so that they can thrive. So it's been great. Jill Brook: And you know, I know whenever we talk about exercise, there's always that percentage of people who have ME CFS or the post exertional malaise and they say, yes, we want to exercise. We know you all who can exercise feel so much better when you do. But there's that percentage of us who feel a lot worse. Do you have any knowledge of any tips or tricks or resources for them. Kait: Yeah. Yeah. So CFS you know, definitely different than POTS, right? That, that [00:26:00] population. But what's interesting with dysautonomia or dysfunction of the autonomic nervous system, we have so many of the same symptoms. So if you've received, if individuals have received CFS as a diagnosis, I have found necessarily the Levine Protocol isn't always the answer for that, right? You need to do things more in moderation. I would say it's, it, it is more the intensity doesn't need to be as high there, but there's still things that can feel good. Stimulation to help blood flow, right? Just to, to that, I mean, that is something that should be worked out directly with your coach or your medical, you know, professional, but still being active has so many benefits. But it doesn't necessarily need to follow that protocol specifically. What's interesting too is just just training of like trigger training. So it's, it's you know, POTS Strong, it's not just exercise. It deals, we teach, there's nutrition and behavioral therapies along with it. You know, it's a wellness approach. And so, what's interesting is I've had clients with vasovagal syncope or you [00:27:00] know, Lyme's or there was CFS. You know, and so it's really just taking, it's, you have to make it specific for the individual, really listen to what they, what they are feeling on a day-to-day basis. What, what, you know, what they are going through. And it's all about, yeah, just changing those variables so that they're succeeding, but consistency is key and yeah, like you're right. And if you overexert, they can pay for it for a couple of days, right? So, so just finding that appropriate dose. Jill Brook: And I guess I would just say yeah, and we're not giving, we're not giving any advice out here listeners, especially to the ME CFS patients who might have post exertional malaise, cause my understanding is it can be worse than feeling bad for a couple days. My understanding is it can, it can do some damage, you know, for some unfortunate people. So, yeah, definitely talk to your doctors. But okay, so now that you are practically POTS free and you're feeling so good that you, you don't have to do cardio if you don't want to. [00:28:00] I'm guessing, do you still need to eat much salt? Kait: No, no. I, I mean, I, what's interesting for, for me personally I've always found to have certain sensitivities with foods. I just, I'm a very whole, I'm just a whole food eater. I don't, I process, I've just never been drawn to. I do not eat fast food. Things like that, right? Like I just, my, I, I realize I have certain sensitivities but other than that, I mean, no. Jill Brook: Can we end with a speed round where you just say the first thing that comes to your mind? Kait: Sure. Jill Brook: What's your favorite time of the day and why? Kait: Morning. I think it's just like quiet, peaceful, like before the world starts. Jill Brook: Where is your favorite place to spend time? Kait: Probably just nature. Like in the woods. Jill Brook: What is some good advice that you try to live by? Kait: Yeah I think the biggest one is our, I believe our environment shapes us. If it doesn't challenge you, it doesn't change you. I think that the one thing we can [00:29:00] always count on in life is change. Jill Brook: What is something small or inexpensive that brings you comfort or joy? Kait: Ghirardelli chocolate. Jill Brook: Who is somebody that you admire? Kait: My parents. Jill Brook: What are you proud of? Kait: My family. Jill Brook: What is an activity that you recall being able to enjoy even when really, really POTS y? Kait: An activity that I enjoy. Oh, geez. Traveling. I love to travel. Jill Brook: What helps you fall asleep, if anything? Kait: Fall asleep. Probably, like, the hot tub and then, like, essential oils. Like, just peace. Jill Brook: What gives you energy when you need it? Kait: I would just say eating well, overall, gives me great energy. Jill Brook: What is a gift that you would have sent to every POTS patient on Earth if you had infinite funds? Kait: If I had to pick one that really makes sense would be liquid IV. Jill Brook: What is something you're grateful [00:30:00] for? Kait: Health. Jill Brook: Okay, and the last question, what do you wish more people understood about POTS? Kait: Oh, people understood about POTS. I feel like POTS is such an invisible illness, even though we exhibit at the time, right, these symptoms where we're looking tired and just things aren't right, right? But, I wish that the, the world understood that, what it is, right? They just were educated that this is a real illness that it is life altering, and with the appropriate education and tools we can better support the POTS community and, and help lift them up. Jill Brook: Wonderful. Well, Kait, thank you so much for sharing your story and all of your insights. We will put a link to your website in the show notes if people want to check you out there. And we just really appreciate all your time today. Kait: Yeah, thanks Jill. Thanks for what you're doing for the POTS community. This is great. Jill Brook: Okay, listeners, that's all for today. We hope you enjoyed the conversation. We'll [00:31:00] be back again next week, but until then, thank you for listening. Remember you're not alone, and please join us again soon.